Holy Spirit 3: How Does the Holy Spirit Speak to Us?

As Christians, we were taught to follow the Bible. But what about how to actually hear from the Holy Spirit that dwells within us? There's a gap here, and many believers quietly live in it, trying to follow the rules without a working sense of what inner divine guidance even feels like.

This third episode in our Holy Spirit series takes up that gap directly. Starting from Paul's charge in Galatians 5:25 to "keep in step with the Spirit," we ask the practical question: what does that actually look like in real time? Drawing on the story of Elijah in 1 Kings 19 — where God was absent from the wind, the earthquake, and the fire, but present in a still small voice — we explore how the Spirit tends to communicate beneath the noise of ordinary life. God invites us to seek him, and to listen.

We look at three distinct modes of Spirit communication: the gut-level inward witness, the clear messages that sound like your own thoughts but feel as if they were placed, and the rare but unmistakable inner statement that arrives with clarity and sudden force. Amanda and Raychel share their own experiences hearing directly from God. Turns out, the Holy Spirit's guidance often works one step at a time, showing you where to place your foot next without ever handing you a map of the whole path. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:45

Welcome back to our third episode on the Holy Spirit. First, we talked about our anatomy and the different parts of our bodies and how they're represented in the Bible. Last time we talked about the Holy Spirit and how that lives in us, how it was given to us, and sort of how and where does it dwell?

SPEAKER_00 1:05

Yeah. And so today would be a good follow-up on how do we listen to the Holy Spirit? How does the Holy Spirit talk to us? And what does this process look like? So we're gonna go ahead and start with a good scripture on Galatians 5 25, which says, if we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. Nice. So what do you think that that means in regards to this episode and moving forward with the Holy Spirit?

SPEAKER_01 1:30

So I think there's a gap sometimes, maybe not for everybody. For me, there was in sort of like post-salvation education, I was never really taught what to do next. It was more framed as, so here's how you live well by doing the things that the Bible says and not doing the things that the Bible says not to.

SPEAKER_00 1:51

Sure, it's very prescriptive, like, oh, just don't sin, and then kind of like kicking you out on the street.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

I was not taught that the Holy Spirit living within me means that I have access to the very Spirit of God and therefore guidance.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

Absolutely. Like I always learned that guidance was strictly through mentorship, through the church, through pastors, not that we actually had the guide directly inside of us. Right. And so we kind of want to step into how the guidance of the Holy Spirit shows up. And so I'm gonna read a verse from 1 Kings 19, verses 11 through 12, and this is the ESV. And he said, Go out and stand on the mount before the Lord, and behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind tore the mountains and broke in pieces the rocks before the Lord, but the Lord was not in the wind, and after the wind an earthquake, but the Lord was not in the earthquake, and after the earthquake a fire, but the Lord was not in the fire, and after the fire the sound of a low whisper. And that's the end of that passage. And so this is used a lot when discussing the Holy Spirit because it is showing us that God's guidance is often not a big, chaotic, explosive moment, but rather settling down and listening to his quiet voice. Other translations phrase the end of that as a still small voice. You heard us mention that, I think maybe last time too, that oftentimes the Holy Spirit is a messenger from God and he speaks in a still small voice.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

And I think that's important because we hear a lot of loud things in and around us. Yeah. Right. And especially when you look at desire, that's not necessarily what we're talking about today, but our desires are like human needs are usually very loud. Like if I'm thirsty, I know I'm thirsty.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

That's a good point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:45

The voice of the Holy Spirit being small or still means we have to be able to hear it.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

Because it's not trying to smack us in the head. Although it sometimes does. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:58

And have learned. Totally. And that's talked about in Kenneth Hagin's book on how to be led by the Holy Spirit. But he does talk about how sometimes you will just hear kind of a loud voice. It's not as common. Some people never hear that. And so it's totally fine if you don't get a message like that. But still, it's very commanding. It's not chaotic. It still is gonna come with a quiet conviction within peace.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

You'll hear Christians say that they heard from God or God told them that they need to XYZ. Or I remember in church actually, one day our worship pastor was talking about looking for a house and God told him where he and his family were supposed to go. I remember just thinking, like, uh, actually. So I think the question that I have had for a long time that I think a lot of other people might have is when somebody says that they have heard God tell them to do something, it's like, are you serious? Like, are you being literal? Did you actually hear God tell you what to do?

SPEAKER_00 4:59

Yeah, and people say it a lot like, oh, God told me to go down to the grocery store. Right. I just was convicted and I went. And it's like, because people use the phrasing, he told me. Yeah. So to me, that's more than just, oh, I had a sensation. Like I people don't say that, right? I had this sensation to go down to the grocery store. It's like God told me. And I would hear that too and be like, never really fully understood what that meant.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

Yeah. So I think what we're learning is that actually does mean something. And people are actually saying it literally. You know, we hear this in the Bible too. God says, if you seek him, you'll find him. And if you turn to him, he will answer you. Yeah. So when we have the Holy Spirit living in us, we always have access to it. Yeah. So what's happened here, I think, is that a lot of people aren't learning that we're supposed to tune in to the Holy Spirit and listen.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:52

And when we're listening, you actually can hear whether that works out in a few different ways for different people, but you can literally be led by the spirit.

unknown 6:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:04

And I think it's fair to say it takes practice too, which we'll get into. It's not something that's necessarily going to be innate for us in our civilization because we live in a noisy world. And I think people could come to a quick conclusion that, oh, he's just not speaking to me. I'm somehow different, or maybe I'm flawed. I can't tune into that.

SPEAKER_01 6:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

But there are ways we can tune into that frequency.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Yeah. And I think one of the first steps in that is to kind of identify how you as an individual are able to hear. Yeah. Because it can happen in different ways for different people. So if you don't know how you hear and you're trying to listen in one specific way, yeah. It might just not work for you.

SPEAKER_00 6:48

Right. So we have a mutual friend, Katie, who doesn't have a lot of self-chatter going on in her mind. And so God speaks clearly to her in words a lot more frequently than me with ADHD, who I'm constantly having background conversations, music, noise. And I think he speaks to me more perhaps through feelings and nudges. Not to say he doesn't speak through me through words, but I have to be very intentional about those moments. So I think he is going to play on our strengths, right? Like he does want a positive relationship with us. He's not trying to fool us. Like he wants us to be successful.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

So we'll talk about some of those different ways, right? That different people hear in different ways. But I wanted to find scripture that actually supports us hearing because we know that the Holy Spirit is our helper. We know that it's part of God. But I was like, is the Holy Spirit actually telling us stuff? Totally. And it is. Spoiler alert.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

Um so yeah, let's let's dive into Acts 13 2. See what Luke has to say.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Isn't it Paul?

SPEAKER_00 7:50

No. Right? It's Luke, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Yeah, it was Luke. Sorry for arguing with so Acts 13 2, Luke says, While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them. So that's interesting because the Holy Spirit says it's not even getting metaphorical or anything. It's just the Holy Spirit said this. Also interesting that to set that up, they were worshiping and fasting, which I think shows us a little bit of that like preparing and being in the right heart space to even hear from the Holy Spirit. Yeah, absolutely. And then there's also, I want to go backwards to Acts chapter 10. There's another one, verse 19, says, And while Peter was pondering the vision, the spirit said to him, Behold, three men are looking for you. So again, Peter's thinking, pondering, pondering a vision, even it just literally talks to him. Yeah. So I think that answers some of my question of like, is the Holy Spirit actually supposed to be talking to us? Yes. Totally.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

And sometimes we might just think, oh, it's just us having a thought, and I'm gonna follow it. So the more that you practice and discern, as we're gonna go into in a second what discerning looks like, you will start to notice the difference between the Holy Spirit and your own voice.

SPEAKER_01 9:15

Yeah. So I really like how when you're talking about hearing from the Holy Spirit, you call them nudges. You get little nudges. Little nudges. Or you get nudge this way, nudge that way. Yeah. Tell us more about that. My experience is different. I don't get nudges so much as I guess mine is in two ways. Sometimes it's like a gut feeling or like some kind of clarity in my gut. Yeah. And then I do sometimes have clear vocal thoughts, but they sound like me. Yeah. But then it's obviously not me.

SPEAKER_00 9:47

Right. But you get nudges. Yeah, I feel like I do get nudges. And I think like a good example of a recent nudge is I had this thought that I wanted to write a book on mental health and Christianity in some way, but I kept like doubting it and thinking, like, well, I'm not, I'm not a Christian counselor in any way. So like I doubted myself. And then I was in the car with Rachel after we had like an interesting experience somewhere. And I was like, Yeah, I'm not a theologian. Like I should not be writing a book on mental health and Christianity. And Rachel was like, Well, that's dumb. And then I was like, I mean, you said it probably nice to be. I was gonna say, did I I don't know if I said no, but I mean basically it's like, well, no, you obviously have the ability to write a book like that. And I was like, oh, okay. So part of I think my nudge that came to follow this conversation was because we were literally talking about it, we were actively engaged in conversation around it. Is this something that I should do? And then so, anyways, we park, we're neighbors, Rachel and I. And I'm walking, and it was nighttime. Remember that guy with a cigarette? Anyways. Oh yeah. Yeah. And so, anyways, she's watching me walk home at night. So I didn't get murdered on it. Just in case. Spoiler alert, I didn't know. No, he was fine. He he didn't do anything. He was just standing there. But and I just got like hit. That was more of like a what's bigger than a nudge? A push? It was a push. And it was like it's weird to like explain a feeling that's not in words, but it essentially was like if the words you need to write a book on mental health and Christianity, that's what the feeling was. It was like an all-knowing. Like, nope, this is exactly what I need to do. And I did doubt myself for a couple days after because there's books like that. This is not groundbreaking in any way. And I was like, I just don't know which direction to take it, anxiety, depression, all this. And then I kept doubting and doubting again, even though I had the push, which is like what I probably shouldn't have been doing. And then eventually I was like, I need days went by, even maybe a couple weeks. And I decided to just meditate on it. So I prayed and I meditated, and I got out of the shower, and then it was another push, and it was like, it has to be ADHD in Christianity. And that was it. And it just came to me like, nope, that's absolutely it, no question. And then I haven't had a doubt since. Wow. So it's like it's a push, but it's pushing you into confidence. Yeah, I think confidence is a good word to put it. It's an all-knowing. It's almost as if like once someone tells you, oh, like water is H2O, and then you look at it and go, oh, that makes sense that there's two hydrogens and one oxygen. And like you understand that compound and you go, Oh yeah, I'm all knowing. Now I understand how this works. You can never really unknow that. Yeah, that makes sense. So I've mentioned Ken Hagen before. So Hagen talks about three different ways that the Holy Spirit talks with people, but in terms of nudging, the inward voice more closely relates to my experience. It's not an audible voice, and it feels like a clear impression or statement inside. And it sounds like your own internal thoughts and experience, but it carries an unusual clarity or persistence. It could be something like don't go that direction, in my case, more like you need to write this book, but it wasn't a voice. And I think Hagen also talks about how if you are maybe you're debating two things, like you have two job offers and you're like, I'm not sure which one might be a better fit. Hagen's framework is to listen to the gut. So the Holy Spirit's gonna talk through your gut. I think we may have talked about that last time. I think you could also get nudges that way, but most of the time in my life, it just happens, you know? Yeah. So the third part that Kenneth Hagen says the Holy Spirit talks to people is through the voice of the Holy Spirit. So it's a strong inner statement, a moment of unmistakable clarity, and it could be very distinct. And so this is the one that isn't as common because it's like a voice. Do you hear an actual voice?

SPEAKER_01 13:19

Yeah, so I have had that happen just a few times. It feels like an inner voice. It's not audible as in I'm hearing it through my ears. I think it's more closely related to an inner voice. It's just happening as literal words in my head.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

It's your own voice, because there is a distinction. There's a nudge, hearing your own voice or hearing literally another voice. Yeah. So those are the three ways. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:41

So I do get nudges as well, because I think the other part you were talking about being lead in your gut, I experience that a lot. That's probably the most common way if I'm able to ask and then just tune in to my gut. Yeah. And that feels more like just clarity. Totally. Not necessarily like a thought. Or even like a relief sometimes. I think this is the decision. And if I tune in, then it's either a little bit vibratey or uncomfortable in my gut. Or as soon as I get tuned in, then it's just like relief. Totally. Just clear. And then that's kind of what tells me that which direction. Yeah, that's the right direction to go. But I have had me in my head. Yeah. But I know that it's not me thinking it. That makes any sense. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

Um yeah, totally. It's like someone copied and pasted you speaking into your brain suddenly. Like you can tell when you've thought of something versus when a thought was placed in your head or a sentence was placed in your head.

SPEAKER_01 14:40

And it happens quickly and loud. It's not like I'm trying to formulate this thought. No, it's like a it's random. It's like a lightning in my head. Right.

SPEAKER_00 14:49

It's not like what are the different types of frogs? And then all of a sudden in your mind, you're like, oh, we should talk about toads. That's too related. Yeah. You're just walking down the street and it's like, Rachel, you need to go to Home Depot. Kind of like that.

SPEAKER_01 14:59

Yeah. So we were in church one time, and the pastor came out onto the stage, and he was like, surprise everybody, even though I hate surprises. God told me that I need to set aside the sermon that I have prepared today. And we're gonna spend the next 40 minutes in basically like whole church prayer. Yeah. And it was interesting because you could tell that he was like convicted about doing this, but he was also very open about being like, this was not my plan. Yeah. He was like, I worked really hard on my sermon. I want to give it to you, but it was so clear that that's what God wanted him to do. So he basically from there he started to give us kind of like our prayer framework of what he wanted everyone to pray about and for. And it was all around strongholds. So he was talking about things that are built up around our hearts that like harden our hearts, kind of. Yeah. And so the question was like, what strongholds do you need to like break down to allow God to work in your heart? So we started talking about things like anxiety or like love of money or like an enemy relationship that you have that you just can't get past. Like there's no way that you can forgive that person. Yeah. Whatever. So we move into prayer, and I just remember I lowered my head. I'd never actually heard from God before. This is actually the first time I ever heard from God in any way. Yeah. So just I put my head down to like dutifully enter prayer. Like, I like surprises and I like when we throw routine out the window. So cool. I don't know how it's gonna take 40 minutes to pray, but let's do it. So I put my head down and I asked the question that he told us to ask, which was, what are the strongholds that I need to work on? And he he challenged us to start with the question, not bringing our strongholds to God, but actually just first asking, What are the strongholds? And I was prepared already to then start praying about my strongholds, which I was pretty sure were gonna be things like anxiety and fear, and like I always have lots of thoughts and conversations going on in my head. So all of this stuff is happening at the same time, like in a moment. I asked the question, I'm very prepared to go into so anxiety. Like, how can I let that go? And just so clearly, my own, as soon as I finish asking the question, like what are my strongholds that I need to let go of? Yeah, in my own head, it was like my career. And I remember just being so shocked, like what? It was just so clear, and I was like, wait, right, because you're like anxiety. I was like, that's not what we're talking about. Totally, God, yeah, like we're not talking about my career right now. Yeah, my career is going great. So I just remember being shocked, first of all, because like it came out of nowhere. And you also have no problem with your career, right? And so then that led me into like what does that even mean? Like, why is my brain saying my career? I didn't know what it meant, so then I just followed prayer from there.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:09

It turned out it was definitely things in my career, and it was definitely God opening my eyes and kind of allowing me to prepare for things that would be changing in my career.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

Yeah, and I think sometimes we'll hear things from the Holy Spirit that maybe we don't fully understand quite yet, and maybe he's preparing our hearts for change. That whole day, you probably you didn't know the whole picture.

SPEAKER_01 18:31

Right. And it also literally didn't make sense. I'm praying to you about what I need to let go of. I'm not gonna let go of my career. Like, I need to pay my bills. And so I'm thinking, like, well, am I putting too much of myself into my career and I need to like prioritize differently? And like, I was trying to figure out what that meant when the sense was very clearly to let go of my career. Yeah. Just literally did not make sense.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

Just because we're getting something from the Holy Spirit doesn't mean in that moment we'll completely understand it either.

SPEAKER_01 19:03

Right. And I did not go home and quit my job, but I did end up having difficult transitions that were not all by my choice. And then there was another time I went outside to my backyard because I was just overwhelmed. I actually was quote unquote letting go of my career, but at the same time, I was actually having more work and I had a lot of pressure too, and there were a lot of scary changes happening. So I went outside and I was just like, where do I prioritize? Like, I see you're giving me all of this stuff, and that's great. And thank you. How do I get it all done? Where do I need to put my time? And what I was really looking for was tell me which client to work on. What am I supposed to do? Again, same thing. As soon as the question like left my brain, yeah, the answer came and it was at my church. And I was like, no, that's actually not what we're talking about. Like, you must have misunderstood my question. No, no, no, yeah. And the answer was just kept sort of reinforcing itself and was like, no, the answer to that question is the church and putting my time into the church. Yeah. To a degree of clarity that like I couldn't argue with it. And again, it still didn't make sense because I did not have time.

SPEAKER_00 20:15

So Rachel went from a W-2 basically to contractors with multiple people. Yeah. At that point, did you have a contract with the church? No. No. So you were just volunteering. So you're thinking, what does this mean? And then shortly after, didn't you get approached from the church to do work?

SPEAKER_01 20:27

Yeah, it was three or four months. Yeah. And what God was trying to do is get me to stop being sort of beholden to my work. And by putting my time in to church, it was leading me to other things.

SPEAKER_00 20:42

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 20:43

And it was teaching me things that I needed to know in order to have a relationship with God. And I think that's probably why I was hearing him in that loud, singular thought voice way at that time, because I didn't really know how to tune in otherwise.

SPEAKER_00 21:00

Absolutely. And now when the opportunity presented itself, you could say, I get it now, God. This is what you were preparing me for. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:08

I mean, that's really cool. And now I am learning more how to understand like the gut feelings. So I guess that is nudges just in a different way. Yeah. The nudges present themselves differently.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:21

I haven't had like the thinky thoughts in a while. And I think maybe it's just because I don't necessarily need them as much right now. You're following the steps that were already laid out from those thinking thoughts. Yes. But he had to give me those at first to even like get me on a track.

SPEAKER_00 21:37

And the Holy Spirit's job is to lead us towards the Word and towards Jesus. Like that's the Holy Spirit's goal and like what it wants for us and for the will of the kingdom. Yeah. And so if you're already on that track, you might not need as extreme of nudges. There could be big adjustments that come down the road, you know, that we might need to follow. But right now, maybe that's just not where you're at. Yeah. And I think it's good to mention too, I read a book called Living Fearlessly by Jamie Winship. And his approach to the Holy Spirit is a little different from Hagen's in that you ask a question to God, either out loud or in your mind, like through prayer, and you write down the first thing that comes to your mind. One of his prompts, which is really cool, is so if you're listening, you can try this also tonight, is to just ask God, what name do you call me by? And then literally the first name, you know, and maybe practice meditating too before, you know, and get your your mind in the right space. But you might be surprised at what comes up. So people get different things. Yeah. You got bond servants. Bond, thank you. I forgot. Because I was like, What?

SPEAKER_01 22:42

Yeah, you told me that and that's what I said. I was like, Yeah. Like I was expecting like, you know, my beautiful sheep or like my warrior.

SPEAKER_00 22:50

Like my beating heart. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:52

And it was all bondservant. And that wasn't bond servant.

SPEAKER_00 22:54

I was thinking of like bounty hunters and like jail bond people. Totally. Like I um envisioned someone basically chained to a ground. And I was like, and I kept thinking, there's no way I would have just said bondservant. So in the Bible, bond servant means it's someone who chooses obedience out of love and devotion and sees their life as dedicated to God's purposes. So then when I started reading that, I was like, oh, okay. And then when he was like Paul the Apostle called himself a bondservant in Romans 1-1. And so that is one time that I heard my own voice pretty quickly, but I was very intentional. I asked a question. So you were ready to receive. I was ready to receive an answer. My mind felt I felt ready. Like I'm not gonna ask that question if I'm on like a busy train, maybe. Not to say you can't, but for me personally, I felt like I had to be in a peaceful environment, a quiet one.

SPEAKER_01 23:46

And so bondservant is actually a pretty special title. I thought that was really cool when I figured out what it is. One cool thing, I just learned this like last week. Yeah, that a bondservant would pierce their ear to basically voluntarily bind themselves to cool a master or an authority at will. So it's different than saying, like, yes, you're my mom, so I will do what you say. I can walk away if I want to.

SPEAKER_00 24:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

But I really want to actually live and follow under your authority. Yeah. So then the ear piercing would permanently bind you to basically servitude of that authority. So when you're a bond servant of God, is it one ear pierced?

SPEAKER_00 24:33

It's weird because like I had when I was younger, I got both ears pierced, but one just kept getting infected. So, anyways, my entire life only had one ear pierced. Oh, that's cool.

SPEAKER_01 24:40

So I was like, wouldn't that be cool? And I think it was actually like way more dramatic. I think they would like actually like nail their ear a post to the scarring and stuff after that. Or maybe they actually wore like a poop earring or something. Oh, I know, I wonder. Yeah. So I mean, obviously that was a long time ago. Different cultures are gonna use ear piercings to represent different things. But so I got when I asked that question, yeah, it was same thing. I prepared myself. So I yeah, I asked it intentionally and I was ready for an answer. Things were pretty still and quiet. I was not as sure about what I heard as like when I get that booming thought. And I'm like, whoa, what was that? Like, that's not it was not like that at all. It was almost like a I had to almost like grasp it before it like disappeared. And then I wasn't even really sure if that's what it was. Yeah. So I got the word child. Honestly, it felt like a little silly at first. I was like, really? That's what you call again. Like it's not a good idea.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

Did it feel like demeaning, or like, or is that not the right word?

SPEAKER_01 25:41

Not demeaning, but just aren't all believers children of God and like also children are like, you know, loud and messy and running around breaking stuff. You do love macaroni. What does that mean? Why would that be what you call me when you call my friend Amanda bondservant? Right. And I'm just child. However, after just sort of thinking and praying on it and then sleeping on it, I just became more sure that that's what that was it. Yeah. And I mean, it felt endearing. And I think it is it is endearing, but it also was like maybe representative of like spiritual maturity in a way. Yeah. Where I'm eager, I'm following, I'm like soaking it up. Yeah. But I also I need guidance. I need direction. Yeah. And I have like a lot to learn. Like I have to grow into it, kind of. Yeah. But I also realized once I sort of accepted that like that's what he calls me. Yeah. It actually created like a stronger path for me to feel God's love, which was interesting.

SPEAKER_00 26:42

Stripping away any denial of what he thinks you are. Right. So that opens up just this beautiful connection, I think.

SPEAKER_01 26:49

Yeah. So now when I think about being child in air quotes, like that's my identity. It actually feels good. It makes me feel like all cuddly. I remember even that night, like going to sleep in bed, I was so cozy. I was just curled up and I was just so childlike happy.

SPEAKER_00 27:05

The life of a child is so protected and loved by its parent. What an honor to be called that. Yeah. It was just really nice. Yeah, that's really cool. So I think the next good segue from this is how do you discern? I think it's pretty well understood in the Bible as well that not to be impulsive, right? So if you have a big thought, you have a big nudge or a push or you hear something, acting instantly is not the point. It's to also get clarity from other things. So that might be clarity from a church leader. It may be, okay, actually I did pray on it more and I got more of a voice and just feeling it in your gut. Does this feel right? And then another big one is checking it against scripture. Is this message that I'm getting in alignment with scripture? So that's a big first filter to use a lot when you are hearing something from the Holy Spirit and wondering if that's where it's going to come from, because God isn't going to ever, or the Holy Spirit won't ever tell you something that goes against his word. Yeah. And so otherwise it could be the enemy trying to turn you a direction that's not God-led.

SPEAKER_01 28:10

Yeah, I think that's important if the voice of God is not loud. We hear a lot of loud things. So well, and a couple of my messages from God have been very loud. But that being sure that what you're hearing is the Holy Spirit, I think that's a really important practice. And like it takes time to develop because otherwise we can just be led astray. Like you and I, all the time, we're really good at coming up with ideas and thoughts. Yeah. All the time.

SPEAKER_00 28:39

Yeah. And then we want to just go. Oh, yeah. Um, we get in like again with ADHD, like I've had a hard time with discernment, or at least it's been a journey for me because I get impulsive ideas all the time. Like I'm always wanting to create businesses and ideas and plans and all of these things. So I had to sit back and say, when I do get a nudge from something, okay, is this coming from me, the enemy? Is this the Holy Spirit? Like what is happening? Yeah. Okay, so in Ecclesiastes, one of the takeaways from me was when making life choices, ask, does this decision increase peace and flourishing for my family, or does it push us into stress and striving? So I think that's another filter you can use if you're starting to feel led by the Holy Spirit. Will this choice lead you into chaos? Yeah, oh, actually this might be peaceful, like long term, right? I mean, I think there often can be stress when we change and adjust our lives for certain directions.

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Yeah, well, and important to remember that peace in its literal and biblical definition, peace is not absence of conflict. Good point. Yep. It is calm and confidence in conflict. So it's not to say, like, will this choice lead you into conflict? It's will you be in chaos or will you be in that calm, confident peace area?

SPEAKER_00 29:55

Right. Like peace and flourishing doesn't mean without stress. Right. But chaos and striving is different.

SPEAKER_01 30:01

Right. And I I think why that's so important is because chaos does not lead to production or spiritual fruit or creation or chaos. Totally. Things are just spinning, not doing anything. I mean, really, chaos is like destruction. It's what existed before God ordered creation. Absolutely. It's just the opposite of stuff. Stuff. Yeah. It's just like crazy nothingness.

SPEAKER_00 30:26

So I think that's a good filter. But I was even pondering this the other day. Sometimes you can have two good choices, like say it's two job offers, and both feel like they could be peaceful and flourishing, right? Neither are chaotic. A maybe he is saying, I think either choice might be good.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 30:41

We've led you down the path to have two successful choices.

SPEAKER_01 30:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:45

Or maybe it's a matter of sitting on it a little longer.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

Yeah. You get to a point where you feel like it's not a right or a wrong choice, but it's your choice to make and you sort of feel at peace with either way. Either. Yeah. I think that also shows us that sometimes our choices are not meant to be as much about us as we make them. Absolutely. So we sort of build our own lives and we make choices based on how it's going to affect our life. Right. Even when we're making choices that are in alignment with Jesus, we're usually doing it to better our lives. Yeah. And the whole challenge of Jesus is to love others and make other people's lives better. Yeah. So I think sometimes when it's, well, do you want me to do A or do you want me to do B? I feel like sometimes, not to make it sound this cavalier, but it's like, I don't really care. If you do A or B, as long as you're not hurting C over here, do what you want because that's not actually what I'm focused on.

SPEAKER_00 31:41

Or it's like if you do A or B, make sure you are still aligning with having it with love.

SPEAKER_01 31:45

If you've got that down, it might not matter if you go to the grocery store today or tomorrow. Right. Or which job you take. Totally. It might or it might not. And I think that's why getting to that level of discernment where you can figure those things out is really important.

SPEAKER_00 32:00

Yeah. And I think part of discerning too is I saw this on TikTok, so I can't remember who was talking about it, but the butt. So sometimes we'll get a nudge or have a pretty strong conviction of like, say it is go to the grocery store. If you are getting these strong convictions, you are certain that this is spirit-led, but then you have a butt like go to the grocery store. Oh, but I have to get gas first. So I'm gonna wait until tomorrow. Or oh, the sun just set, so I'm gonna wait. Right. There's butt. Oh, I have butts all the time. If you feel like this really is spirit-led and you have a but, just ask yourself, is this but coming from the flesh? Is this, oh no, but this will inconvenience me?

SPEAKER_01 32:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:39

And I think it's also important to remember too that God isn't going to say you go and you don't listen to something he says, that he's not like hanging up the phone and he's like, useless. Yep. Forever. The Holy Spirit's going to continue to lead you. Yeah. So say you choose the job C, the Holy Spirit's still there and he's still guiding you. His job is always to guide you back to Jesus and the Word.

SPEAKER_01 33:01

Yeah. I think that's really important to understand too, because we can and do make wrong choices all the time. Someone told me this morning, actually, that our God is a God of many chances. Yeah. It's like, oh, and thank goodness. Thank goodness. It's like we need them. Yeah, totally. So I think if you find yourself having rejected direction from the Holy Spirit, you're always going to be guided back. Yep. And God is always waiting for us to come back. Totally.

SPEAKER_00 33:28

So I think that's it's comforting. We're not striving for perfection, but the more we can listen, the better I think our lives will unfold. And you build relationships with people. Yeah. Like Rachel and I knew each other for well, she would work late, so I didn't know you like super, super well the first six months while you were in your little career chaos. Yeah. And then when you quit your W-2, suddenly Rachel was around all the time and we could hang out with our kids, which I think was like part of the holy design. Don't want to speak for you, Holy Spirit, but I'm just saying. But it's a relationship, right? Just like with Rachel and I, like the first six months, yeah, like we would see each other and say hi. It was cordial and fine, and like we learned about each other. But then as the years went on, suddenly now we're a lot closer and we know each other's weird quirks. But that's the same with the Holy Spirit. Like it's a relationship and it takes time to build that.

SPEAKER_01 34:14

Yeah, that makes sense. So you can choose to always be like building on what's there. And you know, I have other neighbors where it's just like, we're friends, yeah, but we're not building anything. This is how we interact, this is how we see each other, this is what we do. Yeah. And that's good. And like because of that, I can't expect to just person A down the street to be there for me when I need them because we haven't built absolutely. We have access to the Holy Spirit if we have accepted Christ. Yeah. That doesn't mean it's gonna really be serving us until we build Yeah, build that relationship.

SPEAKER_00 34:51

Yeah. We'll always have guidance, but with the building of the relationship comes the discernment and like the knowing, oh, this is it. Like I can show up on your doorstep at any time and you'll be like, Oh yeah, come in. But like if a random neighbor comes to your doorstep, you're like, Why are you here? Right. We're not there yet. We're not there yet. Let's go to coffee first.

SPEAKER_01 35:07

This is weird. So let's talk about discernment comes from relationship and like the more you listen and read the Bible, the more you do these things, you get better at discernment, right? Yeah. So then, but let's talk about practicing it because you also hear all the time that you're walking with Jesus or someone is walking with Jesus. That also always confused me because Jesus isn't here. Yeah, like literally, I know that I can live in a way that follows what Jesus said in the Bible. Yeah. Is that walking with Jesus? Probably. Why do we call it that though? And it wasn't until again recently that I realized the more you dig into it, there's a reason that we call it walking with, and because it's not actually walking on your own under a particular model. It is supposed to be literally walking with. And the way that we're able to do that is through that relationship with the Holy Spirit. Totally. So how do we translate hearing and listening and discerning? Not translate, but then transition that into practice or walking with. Does that make sense? Yeah, absolutely. I don't have an answer to that. That's a great question. Well, I think one of the first and maybe clearest and maybe most important answer to that is obedience. Exactly. Once you understand that what you're hearing or the guidance you're getting is from the Holy Spirit, I think at that point it's just very clear that we're supposed to follow it.

SPEAKER_00 36:40

Yeah, and I think obedience is similar to relationships. Obedience means that you're actively doing something, you're obeying. It's not just once, just like a relationship. And so obedience, the more that you are obedient, I think, the more you will be able to discern.

SPEAKER_01 36:53

Yeah. We also learned, I'm not gonna get the science right, maybe an episode for another day. Yeah. But there's like there's a part of your brain that actually strengthens when you do things that you don't want to do. Yeah. Or when you do hard things. Yeah. And then that there was even newer science that says that that part of your brain is actually part of how you communicate with the Holy Spirit. So I think especially when it's stuff that we don't want to do, like when I was supposed to let go of my career. Oh, absolutely. Which that sounds great. Like I actually had a therapist ask me once because I was just in a state of mental chaos. And she asked me what I want to be. When I close my eyes and see myself doing anything, what do I want it to be? And my answer was sitting on a porch in the mountains, drinking whiskey and watching deers graze in a meadow.

SPEAKER_00 37:44

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:45

And she was like, Well, we all want to do nothing. That's not what I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_00 37:49

She's all snapping you in the face.

SPEAKER_01 37:50

Yeah. I was like, listen, you asked me what I want to be doing, that's what I want to be doing. So it's not, do I want to be beholden to a crazy career? No.

SPEAKER_00 37:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

But I also can't just let it go. That's not right. That's not the point, also, right? Like we are vessels for God's work. Right. So some of those things where when you get that clear guidance, but you don't know how to do it, yeah, or it just feels completely opposite to what would be a productive move, like putting my time into the church when I'm buried under bill paying work. Right. But then when you do those things, once you're sure that they're the Holy Spirit, like don't just go out and quit your job. Right. Because you want to. Because you want whiskies and deers. Right. Once you start trying to do what the Holy Spirit wants you to do, though, I think we see over and over good things come from it.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

And that could be another filter too, is like debating two choices. What will the fruit be of these options too? Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:45

So I heard someone say, and this was a few months back, he was talking about getting guidance from God and asking guidance from God. And he was talking about sometimes we have a question or we need direction. And so we go to God looking for that. Yeah. And you basically meet silence. And so what do you do with that? And like that can be really disconcerting. If you're like, God, what do I do here? And then you get nothing. Yeah. Like, what are you supposed to do with that? Yeah. And he said, I thought this was brilliant, but very simply to go back to the last time that you did receive guidance from God. Yeah. And are you still following that guidance or did you follow through on that guidance? Yeah. Because a lot of times you'll find when you're hearing nothing, it's because you're still in that spot.

unknown 39:34

Right.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

It's like, oh, I I actually told you to write this book on ADHD and Christianity. I might not be getting a nudge towards something else until I fulfill that may be the first step. Like if I'm literally on stepping stones, I have to finish that first step first. Right.

SPEAKER_01 39:49

And so if you're like looking off to your right, God, well, should I go this way or should I actually go like a little bit over that way? Yeah. He's like, no, you have to take the next step that's in front of you, but he's not always gonna just keep saying, like, remember, remember what I already told you.

SPEAKER_00 40:05

He's not gonna beat you in the head with like a palm leaf. He's not like, girl, I already told you the first step. Yeah. We've been told if we understand what it is, let's fulfill that first and see what comes exactly when we step on the next stepping stone.

SPEAKER_01 40:18

Yeah. So I think that's really helpful. It puts a lot of power in our hands. Yeah. When we're not sure, yeah. Just go back a little bit and find when you did get direction and just kind of fall back on that.

SPEAKER_00 40:30

Yeah. And if say you did fulfill that last step, I think it's also fair to say if we don't hear anything from the Holy Spirit, it's not a failure. Sometimes we're just not ready for the next step. Maybe you're in a space where the step for you is regulation, maybe learning more discernment. Maybe you're just simply not yet ready to hear it.

SPEAKER_01 40:47

Yeah. Someone told me once about a year ago that maybe I needed to just sit like still and be quiet with the Lord for a while. And I was like, no, that's not what I need to do. Like, why are you saying that? Like, I need to go and do stuff. Yeah. Um, but she was right. I needed to just be where I was.

SPEAKER_00 41:05

Yeah, in our latest Bible study, it was don't just do something, stand there. I love that. And so I think about that sometimes where it's like, we are so action forward or do do do, right? Like we are vessels for the kingdom. We want to do do do. But sometimes we're gonna lose things in translation if we're not sitting and listening. Yeah, or get chaotic because we're bopping around. We're bop, bop, bop. And so if you aren't sure if you've heard from the Holy Spirit before, or this seems kind of like a wild idea, we have a small couple minute guided meditation. Feel free to jet now, or you can sit and do this to maybe get you started on this journey.

SPEAKER_01 41:43

Yeah, because we know that you have to create the space to hear from the Holy Spirit, right? It can be very difficult to hear when things are chaotic in your head and in your heart.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

And so this is a good first start. Okay, so find somewhere comfortable as you would if you're meditating. And allow your shoulders to relax. And we'll start by just taking a slow, steady breath in and gently letting it go. As you breathe, remember that God is already near. Scripture reminds us that the Spirit of God dwells within us and guides us into truth. Take another breath. And as you sit here, you might simply say, Holy Spirit, I welcome you. You don't have to force anything in this moment. Just allow yourself to become aware of God's presence. And as you breathe in, imagine receiving peace. And as you breathe out, let go of tension, any distraction or worry. Now quietly invite the spirit's guidance. Holy Spirit, lead me. Open my heart to your wisdom. Help me recognize your voice in my life. Notice the stillness for a moment. Sometimes the spirit speaks through peace, through gentle conviction, or through a quiet sense of direction. You don't need all the answers right now. This moment is simply about being opening. Our third episode of the Holy Spirit. And what is next week, Rachel?

SPEAKER_01 44:49

Next week, I think we're gonna talk about the cultural gap and why we don't always talk about the Holy Spirit.

SPEAKER_00 44:59

We are like more like chaotic signer offers.

SPEAKER_01 45:02

Until next time. Until next time.